Midlife Dimensions


Valentine's Day - 2/14/11

8:07 PM [doveseyes] bill...I am doing horrible. Just found out a potential health problem that could be bad. I informed my h who said well, I care about you as the mother of my kids by I don’t love you and I want a divorce. then he spent times with each of our kids and bashed me. told them all the reasons he left and pursued tons of women. what say you?

8:07 PM [Bill] Doveseyes: First of all, I am so sorry. In a perfect world, things like this would never happen and I know it breaks your heart to hear such things. Give yourself permission to grieve because these things overwhelm the heart and build up intense emotions which need to be relieved somehow. Then pray like crazy for wisdom to know how to respond. Defending yourself to your kids or retaliating won't do you any good. I think we can all agree to pray for you and ask God to do a physical healing and a healing of the heart.


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February 14, 2011 / Monday Chat with Bill 6-7 pm PST/ CR#2.

8:01 PM [plumcrazy] Hello

8:01 PM [doveseyes] hello plum

8:01 PM [plumcrazy] Doveseyes sorry to hear about your pain Sweetie

8:02 PM [doveseyes] I know...thanks...same to you...how is your h

8:02 PM [Bill] Good Evening everyone.

8:02 PM [doveseyes] good evening...

8:03 PM [lisak] Hello everyone.

8:03 PM [hepsy] hello

8:03 PM [plumcrazy] doveseyes --Ok I guess driving me crazy. complaining of pains but won’t call Dr. Has stress test Fri to see how his heart is healing

8:04 PM [Bill] Pray for us tonight. We are hosting a singles 50s party. We are a little nervous because most of the people who have said they are coming did not buy tickets ahead of time but we are planning on them coming. Pray for a fun night and for the right ministry to happen in people’s hearts.

8:04 PM [plumcrazy] Hello hepsy and Yoli

8:04 PM [yoli] plum: Hey, how are you?

8:04 PM [plumcrazy] Bill _will Do

8:04 PM [yoli] lisak: Thank you for that. It was really good and needed.

8:05 PM [plumcrazy] yoli --I am ok Been talking to a good friend tonight He is cheering me up

8:05 PM [dogwood] doveseyes-- How are you doing today?

8:05 PM [doveseyes] thanks lisa...I also wanted your feedback about the info about my daughter

8:05 PM [doveseyes] yoli...not good...lets pack up and move to chili...or Australia?

8:06 PM [lisak] doveseyes - ok. when are you coming out?

8:06 PM [hepsy] hi lalachrissie - did your h follow through and take your d out?

8:06 PM [hepsy] hi digforhelp - how are you doing tonight?

8:07 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy hi, yes. he was here at5:30 and they left a few minutes later. he was only here for about 3 minutes

8:07 PM [doveseyes] bill...I am doing horrible. Just found out a potential health problem that could be bad. I informed my h who said well, I care about you as the mother of my kids by I don’t love you and I want a divorce. then he spent times with each of our kids and bashed me. told them all the reasons he left and pursued tons of women. what say you?

8:07 PM [Bill] Doveseyes: First of all, I am so sorry. In a perfect world, things like this would never happen and I know it breaks your heart to hear such things. Give yourself permission to grieve because these things overwhelm the heart and build up intense emotions which need to be relieved somehow. Then pray like crazy for wisdom to know how to respond. Defending yourself to your kids or retaliating won't do you any good. I think we can all agree to pray for you and ask God to do a physical healing and a healing of the heart.

8:07 PM [dogwood] doveseyes-- I got your email and will respond to you soon, I understand you and we are about on the same boat, I wish I can just pack and leave right away as well

8:07 PM [digforhelp] hello hepsy - I had a very anxious day. it being valentine's day was can of stressful.

8:07 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - is this the first time you have seen him in person since he left?

8:07 PM [lisak] Welcome digforhelp - I’m Lisa Kahan, assistant to Bill Farrel, President of Midlife Dimensions. This room is here to encourage you and answer questions you have about your current situation. Important: Do NOT share personal information such as an email address, phone #, home address, or any names. Now, here’s how to join in. 1) Type the name of the person you want to speak to before you type your entry. 2)) Use the words “To All” if you have a general entry not directed to one person. 3) Questions are answered quicker when they are short and to the point, so avoid long stories whenever possible. 4) If you’d like to contact someone in the room, email or call us at This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. or 714-768-1777. We’ll have them contact you to exchange information.

8:08 PM [yoli] doveseyes: I’m with you. I'm packed and ready to go. Got my passport and credit cards. Let's go some place exotic though, like Fiji or Tahiti. Just tell me when. I'll help you even if I have to slap you around. LOL.

8:08 PM [doveseyes] lisa...well she is pursuing something locally...I addressed it in the email...any professional advice would be awesome...

8:08 PM [lisak] doveseyes - oh, that's a lot more convenient. I'll be in touch.

8:08 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - I know what you mean. I bought my h a card but didn’t give it to him. He obviously did nothing for me.

8:09 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy his friend called me earlier today to ask if he could borrow my daughter's dirt bike for his daughter. we hadn't spoke in months. had a long conversation about my h. he says my h is really good a building walls and cutting people out of his life. has always done it.

8:09 PM [doveseyes] lisa...thanks so much...I have no clue what we/she is doing...

8:13 PM [yoli] Bill: I’m just going to forge ahead here. Younger daughter is studying in Argentina for 1 semester. She and dad have had some knockdown, drag out arguments. Seems his money, is his money and no one else’s, except for OW. I don't know if it's a combination of OW putting pressure on him or just plain old MLC or him being tight. I truly don't. He was kind of like this before not to this extent. Is this normal?

8:10 PM [Bill] Yoli: Unfortunately, this is all too common, although I would never say it is normal. When we have kids, we make a commitment of all we are and all we have to raise them and help them become who God wants them to be. When people get off track, they often use money as power rather than as a tool to help. Encourage your daughter to keep asking but help her prepare to find other ways to fund her dream if her Dad does not come through.

8:10 PM [yoli] lalachrissie: My h is like that. It's beyond compartmentalizing everything in their lives.

8:10 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - I see... hope he doesn't do that to your daughters... was your d excited about seeing him?

8:10 PM [doveseyes] yoli...yea...that’s sounds like a plan. I just can’t believe how hard hearted my h has become...

8:10 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy it's the first time I’ve seen him since the first week of November, I might have accidently (on purpose) forgotten to put on a bra with my white t shirt...lol

8:10 PM [digforhelp] hepsy - I brought my W a card and flowers. she didn’t accept the flowers and gave them to her mother. but no card for me. but she did give me a bag of candy.

8:10 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - lol

8:11 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy yes. she was pretty happy about it. she stayed home from school today b/c she wasn't feeling well and wanted to be well rested

8:12 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - I am sorry ((hugs)) I know it isn't what you wanted... I had my own expectations, although I knew in my heart I would receive nothing... :(

8:12 PM [doveseyes] yoli how r u

8:12 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - were you nervous when you saw him? Did he try to avoid looking at you?

8:13 PM [Bill] To All: It occurs to me that many of us are struggling with deep disappointment from the rejection we receive from people who are supposed to love us. For me it was my mom. For Pam it was her dad. For many of you it is spouses and children. All of these are bad situations but there is a way to ease the pain. In the midst of all this stuff, we can grow close to Jesus in a unique way that helps us be real friends with Him. He was betrayed by those who were supposed to love Him. He was let down by those He invested in. He was killed by the very people who should have embraced Him. When we cling to Him in the midst of our disappointment we develop a friendship where we share in His sufferings. It is a hard truth but one we should all pursue.

8:13 PM [plumcrazy] ALL--Gave my H a funny card with a squirrel on it with a bag of Heart Healthy nut mix to go with it. LOL

8:14 PM [digforhelp] hepsy - yes I am going to have to start setting my expectations low so I won't be heartbroken.

8:14 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy he didn't avoid looking at me and he made a point to say goodbye when the left. I was very nervous. I bought all new living room furniture this weekend and my house looks completely different. he didn't say anything, but I suspect he'll ask d

8:14 PM [yoli] doveseyes: Okay, just old and tired. I'm so ready for this remodeling to finish. I still have about 1 week left and that's just waiting for some things that I had to order. I'm really busy with work as well which is good but not when there's chaos in the house. Also have bronchitis. I self-diagnosed and am sure that's what it is. Been wheezing especially at night and early morning. And yes, all of our h have become hard-hearted. That's the only way they can wake up and face its day and live with themselves.

8:14 PM [doveseyes] bill...what does a h get out of putting down the w to the kids...I don't understand his point in doing that.

8:14 PM [Bill] Doveseyes: I wish I had a good answer for why men put down their wives to their kids. The reality is that they are immature in conflict resolution and believe they will be stronger if you are weaker. It never works and it has proven to be a bad strategy and yet people use it all the time. It happens with W also when they are off track and it is part of the craziness of sin.

8:15 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy plus I bought myself flowers & I actually got sent flowers and cards from a few friends. They are all on the mantle over my fireplace

8:15 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - well that's a positive!

8:15 PM [yoli] Bill: Yeah, that's what I did. Actually spoke to her through Skype both days this weekend. She said some really ugly things about her dad and I told her to stop talking like that about him. Completely disrespectful. She's really upset that he's telling her what she can and can't do while there. I think it's too late for her to come up with alternate plans for realizing her dream. I mean, she's like 100 to 150 miles from Patagonia and the most southern tip of South America.

8:15 PM [Bill] Yoli: I don't believe she is there by accident and that God has a way of taking care of her there. Encourage her to keep asking Dad to support her and help her do her best not to react to his negative responses. In the long run, he will be glad he helped her.

8:16 PM [doveseyes] wow...are you remodeling the whole house? r u doing all the work yourself?

8:16 PM [doveseyes] yoli...arent' you going to the doctor so the wheezing doesnt turn into something more serious

8:17 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - yes... it is ok to be hopeful, but don't have high expectations...

8:17 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy did you get a gift from your h?

8:17 PM [yoli] doveseyes: It feels like it. It all started because I wanted a gas cook top and then as they began to work, they took out all the cabinets, built new ones, built some bookshelves, and then build some new cabinets in the bathrooms. It's actually turned out to be a lot of work. The dust from all the construction is bad.

8:17 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - that's nice... I got a couple of boxes of candy from my students... I should have bought myself some flowers - I just didn't think of it. I have been in sort of a fog lately... nothing from h

8:18 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie - I bought a card for h but didn't give it to him...he is downstairs eating dinner now...

8:18 PM [yoli] doveseyes: I don't have time to go to the doctor. I'll probably go to one of those minute clinics. Of course, when I go there I usually have to argue with the PA about my symptoms and my diagnosis. They don't like it when I tell them what meds I need. Yeah, I'm not really a doctor; I just play one on TV.

8:18 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy I’m sorry. my h brought a gift for d's to share. d9 & I peeked. he gave them soda, candy & magazines

8:19 PM [dogwood] Bill-- Last week you said twice that with my H going through MLC on a second time, I need to be well prepared. Can you help me on how to prepare myself? H discussed his plan on moving out, buying another house here for himself and divide assets. very finite and determined because he can't stand being with me because that triggers his pain in the past (resentment toward my mother) and which he said was the cause of his lost feeling for me and that led to his infidelity in the marriage. -- I am desperate and very much hurt, can't take it when he moves out and separate. How can I accept this reality of a broken marriage which is perfectly mendable, but H refuses to turn around at all?

8:19 PM [Bill] Dogwood: How do we prepare ourselves for what should never happen? Great question that none of us ever want to face. First, we prepare ourselves by developing a rugged relationship with God that can withstand the ugly stuff of life. Second, we master the process of forgiveness so bitterness does not get a hold of us. Third, we find a circle of friends who can help support us if the worse happens. Fourth, we grow in our skills so if we have to venture out on our own we have skills to work with. All the while, we pray like crazy that God changes the heart of the other. It is an imperfect process that helps us be survivors.

8:19 PM [doveseyes] wow...I am just going to plan a visit and come see all the work....I want to remodel my kitchen too...yea

8:19 PM [plumcrazy] hepsy --- D told me I should go buy myself some flowers for Valentines. Maybe I will tomorrow They will be reduced LOL

8:19 PM [doveseyes] bill. Share in his sufferings...that seems to be what God has been speaking to me these last days. there are many benefits to suffering

8:19 PM [Bill] doveseyes: agreed although it is not what we set out to do, it is a path to a very close friendship with God.

8:19 PM [wiffe] Hi all

8:19 PM [yoli] doveseyes: Come on then. Everything should be finished within 1 week.

8:20 PM [plumcrazy] Bill --really ok with not getting anything from H . I didn’t really think I would.. My kids at school gave me cards and candy

8:20 PM [Bill] plumcrazy: Praise God for His grace in giving you this gift.

8:20 PM [hepsy] plumcrazy - true! I hadn't thought of that! perhaps I will do the same

8:20 PM [doveseyes] yoli...wahoooo

8:21 PM [wiffe] all I think I've done good today. I didn't expect anything from H. (I did expect him to get a card for me from the girls though) I gave him his cheesecake and his card. and the girl's card. I did get my card from the girls. I was fine. He's the one that is struggling. This too shall pass. However what annoys me is we call at 8 and he doesn’t answer his phone. GRRRRRR

8:22 PM [lalachrissie] hepsy/plumcrazy great idea! the flowers I bough myself came with chocolate so I kind of got two gifts. PLUS the other flowers were from friends & h will be alone in the house tomorrow. want to bet he reads the cards?? need to set-up a video camera

8:22 PM [doveseyes] bill...how would you encourage us in our standing...I am getting pressure from my kids to divorce..they are just sick of everything..

8:22 PM [Bill] Doveseyes: remain as patient as possible. The decision to divorce should never be on the kids. I have seen so many situations where the kids encouraged a divorce and then regretted it later. Every marriage is only one breakthrough away from being transformed and we always want to leave the opportunity open from our side. It takes a lot of prayer and wisdom to navigate these types of situations and kids do not have enough life experience to know when the right time is even though they are motivated by sincere love.

8:23 PM [hepsy] wiffe - yes, it is annoying when they don't answer the phone...

8:23 PM [Bluesky] lalachrissie you crack me up

8:24 PM [hepsy] lalachrissie lol

8:24 PM [digforhelp] bill - my W says she's only stressed when she is at home. Why is this? I usually leave her alone when she's home.

8:24 PM [Bill] digforhelp: This is simply a reaction to her inward struggle. She has a war going on inside of her that she is projecting on to you. If she can get you to react unreasonably then she can blame you for what is going on inside of her. it is best, if you can do it, to be relatively unresponsive to these kinds of statements so she can't make your reaction the issue.

8:24 PM [plumcrazy] Bill --Although I have to be honest I wish I had gotten some flowers I love flowers and now I only get them from H on Mother's day

8:24 PM [lalachrissie] Bluesky it's true. You know he's going to read them and he's dying to know where I got the new furniture & how I got the old stuff down two flights of stairs...and how I moved a 200 pound TV by myself

8:25 PM [Bluesky] lalachrissie I liked the no bra and the camera too

8:25 PM [doveseyes] bill...it is amazing how suffering comes in waves...and you wonder when it will get better. Losing a love one who chooses to not be with you is very devastating...and on top of that who chooses another person and say THIS is who I want to be with..Not you

8:25 PM [Bill] doveseyes: Agreed. It is interesting that God refers to Israel as an unfaithful spouse in the Old Testament. The nation He made an unconditional commitment to choose other God who treated them badly rather than staying with the One who would have given them everything they need.

8:26 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - my h is stressed at home too - and I usually leave him alone... I think that is part of why he drinks so much - so he doesn't have to feel stressed - or anything at all for that matter.

8:26 PM [dogwood] Bill-- thanks, I am preparing myself with the help and support of my adult son and daughter, however, they stay neutral now, but will embrace me when the worst takes place. I am not strong enough to be alone. I will learn to pray like crazy, what do you really mean that?

8:26 PM [Bill] dogwood: None of us are strong enough alone for times like these. Pray like crazy means daily, specific prayer that God will change the heart of the one who is causing so much pain and begging God for the grace to keep doing what is right.

8:27 PM [yoli] dovesyes: Yes to what Bill said. I think all of our children are so deeply wounded by the divorce or even the threat of divorce. I saw my daughters scramble for some semblance of normal or their normal. We had to move around a few times - 4 times in 5 years. We never knew what was going to happen from one day to the next. H didn't have much contact with younger daughter for almost 3 years. It's awful. Don't let your children pressure you.

8:27 PM [digforhelp] hepsy - when my W told me she was stressed I thought it was a hint that she wanted to move out and be alone.

8:27 PM [lalachrissie] Bluesky the sales girl when I bought the shirt was awesome. Actually tried it on w/o a bra and needed another size and when she told me I looked cute I asked if I should get a lace bra to wear with it & she said where you wearing it to? So I told her & she said no bra and told me how to fix my hair and told me to wear a necklace to draw more attention...

8:28 PM [dogwood] [bill] thanks

8:29 PM [doveseyes] yoli...good advice...d is just horrible...awful...I hate it...

8:29 PM [yoli] Bill: We never really celebrated Valentine's Day since it's my younger sister's birthday. But now, I've heard that the OW throws a fit if he doesn't give her gifts and cards for everything. So do they lose their backbone or are they just afraid to be alone. Older daughter has said that he's with the OW because he doesn't want to be alone. I've told her that he's alone by choice because he has a family. She just looks at me. How convenient that she was there just when he began to do really well for himself at work. She seems to be the one benefitting from his promotions. She can have it all; I really don't want any of it. But this is so wrong. Does OW really leave when they don't have the luxury of unlimited spending, cut down on going out to eat, etc? I forgot to say that this OW doesn't cook, clean, and does no domestic chores at all. They go out to eat for every single meal. What a life.

8:29 PM [Bill] Yoli: You said it right when you said they lose their spine. No one who is thinking clearly would choose what you just described. In the fog of their emotions, however, people choose others who allow them to be sick while they avoid those who would help them live healthy and responsible. It doesn't make sense and the dots definitely don't connect but it is common when people stop doing what is right to address the pain in their hearts.

8:29 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - what does you’re w usually do at home in the evenings? Watch TV? Laundry? Do you just co-exist?

8:30 PM [Bluesky] lalachrissie ahh that was sweet of her. That is good customer service, something that lack these days

8:30 PM [digforhelp] but hepsy - leaving my W alone is the hardest task I have. It hurts me so much to know that right now she doesn't want anything to do with me.

8:31 PM [digforhelp] hepsy - she goes into our bedroom closes the door and talks on the phone, does something on her computer, or just looks at TV.

8:31 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - I know... I totally feel the same... I try not to dwell on that too much - you shouldn't either... it will make you feel worse.

8:31 PM [MAS] Bill I'm still having trouble with the whole "friendship" thing regarding my H and myself. (Yes, there IS OW.) How does one simply become "just" a friend after being married for so many years?

8:31 PM [Bill] MAS: I would not say you have to become a friend in the normal sense of the word. You have a lot invested in each other. You have made major decisions in life together and you probably have kids and grandkids (if not now, then in the future). All these things keep you connected in some form of a relationship. You want to find a way to interact with him that allows you to have the greatest influence on the rest of the family.

8:31 PM [plumcrazy] digforhelp ---Sounds familiar. No intimacy?

8:32 PM [doveseyes] bill...it just hurts them to see how h treats me with his words, actions, and limits money. How can you tell if what you mlc is doing is sin or a possible mental illness...

8:33 PM [Bill] doveseyes: tough question. This usually requires a collaboration of friends, family members and helping professionals. It is best to assume MLC unless you start to see a pattern of truly irrational behavior that goes beyond defensiveness and pain.

8:33 PM [digforhelp] plumcrazy - not with me. But I'm suspecting with someone else. Maybe only on the emotional level right now. She spends hours on the phone talking to someone.

8:33 PM [wiffe] all I'm being bad and thinking ahead to tomorrow. What happens or what should I do if H takes the girls to the apt before I get home from work. (I tutor for an hour and a few weeks ago he did that and ended up cooking dinner.) He thinks I got mad that he took them there and I got mad he didn’t leave a note or text me.

8:35 PM [MAS] Bill But with OW in the picture, how do I do this?

8:35 PM [Bill] MAS: you look for natural situations that your kids are involved in and you take advantage of natural decisions. A birthday is coming up, how do we want to respond? A graduation is happening, how will we both get tickets? Where will we sit at the wedding? How will we help our kids decide on homes, etc? It is hard because it is not how God intended our lives to be but your involvement in lives of your family members is too important to give up on any of it because there is a OW in the picture.

8:36 PM [hepsy] digforhelp - have you ever asked her who she is talking to?

8:36 PM [dogwood] Bill-- Jim used to advise us not to help with divorce, however, what if H simply wants a separation and never file divorce, but they exchange the free right to date and think that not in the marital bondage as long as they are separated, In other words, not guilty anymore. In fact, H says that many women in modern society do not ask for marriage any way, and that is what H wants as well. In this way, we the left behind suffers although still legally married. -- Any better strategy?

8:36 PM [Bill] dogwood: I will be writing an article on this and posting it in the next week. I will announce in the chat room when it is posted. It is too long an answer to give here.

8:37 PM [dogwood] digforhelp-- does she keep that secret? Did you ever ask whom she is speaking with? My H does that a lot, his cell phone is on vibrate, every night a certain time, he went out to the garage to talk on his cell. In the last few months, he did not come home at all until past midnight. I can’t ask him anything now; otherwise he will think I am monitoring him since I already know his free life style with women

8:37 PM [digforhelp] hepsy - yes, she simply said a friend. Would not give me a name or anything. When I pressed she accused me of trying to control everything.

8:38 PM [lalachrissie] Bill- My H was married before and when they split he cut all contact and were divorced within 6 months. H's childhood friend told me today that my h has always been really good at building walls and blocking people out, just cutting them out of his life. My h's contact is only via email & about our finances. I was already nervous about been left behind, but now I'm scared that he has already.

8:38 PM [Bill] lalachrissie: This sounds like it is his pattern so you will probably need to prepare yourself that he might do this again. If I were you, I would be praying that God changes his heart and I would continue to reach out in natural ways (don't be desperate and email him every hour) but any natural issue that comes up, reach out to him to see if God will do something different with him this time.

8:39 PM [dogwood] Bill-- thanks;

8:39 PM [digforhelp] dogwood - yes, she has even started locking the bedroom door. I think because I walked in on her while she was talking to this person and she kind of looked like I caught her doing some crime.

8:40 PM [hepsy] bill - I find myself feeling nothing... I mean like I feel like I am beginning to not care anymore... it has been over 3 years... Is this normal? Am I starting to become depressed? I don't even cry anymore like I did...

8:40 PM [Bill] hepsy: It could be depression or more likely it is a stage of grieving. When God made Adam and Eve, they were not ever going to lose. When death, disease and disappointment became part of our experience, God gave us grieving as a way of releasing excess emotional energy. There are many faces of grief from tears to anger to numbness to acceptance to bargaining, etc. When we go through trauma, we should expect a process of grief to course through our lives.

8:42 PM [lalachrissie] all- I'm going to take D9 for ice cream b4 it gets too late. Thank you Happy Valentine's Day!

8:42 PM [doveseyes] bill...also how would you counsel someone if they are hearing from God or it’s just themselves? I believe God has spoken and directed me to stand for my marriage but I have people counsel my by saying it’s just you.

8:42 PM [Bill] doveseyes: The best test is the Word of God. I would ask God to confirm what He wants you to do through the Bible. As you read, hear, study, memorize and meditate on scripture, ask God to have verses "jump" off the page to you to confirm what He wants you to do. The question of standing for your marriage is open to everyone's opinion but God will confirm what He wants for you.

8:43 PM [dogwood] digforhelp-- Yes, that happens when they hold on to their "secrecy"; be careful, don't snoop around otherwise she may feel have to run away.

8:44 PM [MAS] Bill It's not easy being just friends when he is parading around with OW and doing things with her that he should be doing with you. I mean, he does spend some family time together, like around the holidays. For example, he spent Christmas Eve with my family and me, but then Christmas with the OW and our D. He also invites OW out to dinner on D's birthday and totally excludes me like I'm not even her mother.

8:44 PM [Bill] MAS: I think you have understated it when you said "It's not easy." It is downright hard and aggravating and requires an incredible amount of maturity to keep your influence going in the lives of your kids when H is doing things like this. You don't do it because it helps him; you do it so you can maintain your integrity and example to Ds. Hang in there.

8:44 PM [plumcrazy] Bill --I like what you told Doveseyes. I will do what you suggested

8:44 PM [doveseyes] bill...I found my h response to my illness interesting...it hurt because I wanted to see where his heart was...and his heart is so hard to me...any insight

8:45 PM [Bill] To All: Sorry I have to go. Our singles event is getting started and I need to make my entrance. God bless you all. Keep trusting God to do through you what is beyond you.

8:45 PM [digforhelp] dogwood - I learned that lesson too late. I got caught snooping and she tried to move out. But did not have any financial means to leave. So she's still here. I believe God stopped her from moving.

8:45 PM [dogwood] Bill-- have a great night with the singles! They need you

8:45 PM [digforhelp] dogwood - I learned that lesson too late. I got caught snooping and she tried to move out. But did not have any financial means to leave. So she's still here. I believe God stopped her from moving.

8:45 PM [dogwood] Bill-- have a great night with the singles! They need you

8:46 PM [lisak] Yoli, I'm still here. I've been playing with the website because we're getting ready to start changing it up over the next few weeks. Little by little, we'll get there.

8:48 PM [lisak] Bluesky - no, not really well, but just a bit. I do the website via Joomla, which is a much simpler way to do a website these days.

8:48 PM [Bluesky] lisak do you know html?

8:48 PM [dogwood] digforhelp-- Good for you! I on the other hand, during holidays, opened 3 H's mail from financial companies (actually the legal counsel whom I saw told me it is legal to open H's mail as long as it mails to our address); although I sealed back but H later asked me about, when I told him that I just want to see which accounts we have, he was very furious about it. I told him that I will never do it again... Bad advice that I received.

8:48 PM [lisak] All - sorry, I always forget to put your question to me thru before I put my answer to you thru. It's probably confusing.......I

8:48 PM [lisak] I'll try to do it right!!!

8:49 PM [Bluesky] lisak hmmm, haven't heard of that, thanks for sharing.

User MAS has logged out.

8:49 PM [lisak] Bluesky - Joomla was created so that most anyone can create a website. I've managed pretty well, but still need to learn to do more with it.

8:50 PM [digforhelp] lisak - what can of advice can you give me? I'm three months into a terrifying breakup with my wife. She tells me she's no longer in love with me but still loves me. And she no longer wants to be married. What can I do besides simply leaving her alone?

8:50 PM [lisak] digforhelp - How are you doing with the issues that women typically complain about when they want to leave their husbands? Women say, 1. He is too controlling, dominating and “it’s all about him.” 2. He doesn't understand that I'm growing (spiritually/mentally) as a person and he is not encouraging me in my career, education, or other activities. 3. He doesn't take care of his physical body, hygiene, and general appearance (sometimes I can't stand to touch his flabby body).

8:51 PM [digforhelp] dogwood - I opened two envelopes that had apartment names on them. I had to see what was going on. But I now resist that urge.

8:52 PM [doveseyes] all...I heard the rejoice ministries telephone conference yesterday and it was great. One couple has been restored after 10 years...it was very interesting. What encouraged me was the restored h said that his wife stood with class. That’s what I want my h to see...me standing for my marriage and doing it with class.

8:52 PM [Bluesky] doveseyes it was good wasn't it.

8:54 PM [lisak] digforhelp - my suggestion is to go about YOUR life.....let her see you have a life. Let her see you working on yourself and changing for the better. She wants you to be interesting and fun again.

8:55 PM [dogwood] doveseyes-- you are so inspirational and strong in your faith

8:58 PM [doveseyes] blue...yes it was...I especially loved the 10 year couple...and I was impressed with charlyne...wow...what a woman of faith

8:58 PM [digforhelp] lisak the first point. - I'm not too sure how I'm doing with that point. I'm trying to not ask her where she's going or calling to check on her anymore. the second point - when I get a chance , which is not much these days, I tell her what a great job she's doing and try to encourage her to pursue her PHD. On the last point - I have lost 30 pounds since this crisis began. And she thinks I look terrible. So I'm starting to go to the YMCA.

8:58 PM [digforhelp] lisak - interesting and fun again? It will take some time to get there. Right now I'm down and depressed, deeply hurt and trying to cope with the lost of my W.

8:58 PM [lisak] digforhelp - make each day count for yourself. You're important to God, you're His child, and you’re His creation. He loves you and you are valuable to Him. Get up and get out there, serve the Lord through your church and community. Stay busy so you don't get depressed and down just sitting around thinking of your wife. Soon she'll start to wonder where you are and what you're doing. It's a good thing.

8:58 PM [doveseyes] dogwood...thx...doesn't feel that way...I feel so weakened now...wonder when it will all end

8:58 PM [Bluesky] doveseyes absolutely. I got a lot of it. I was listening to it while I was out walking and something one of them said really hit me.

9:00 PM [wiffe] lisak it's hard to "go about your life" When you have the kids ALL the time and he gets to act like a bachelor. ya know

9:00 PM [lisak] wiffe - yes I know. I've been there with my husband twice. But the Lord will reward you for your commitment to love the children. Is there anyone you can have watch the kids so you can go out with a friend to coffee, or a movie, or to serve at your church and have some fun? ALL - IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT YOU BE INVOLVED IN A SMALL GROUP BIBLE STUDY AND HAVE THE PEOPLE IN YOUR SMALL GROUP AS YOUR STEADY PRAYER PARTNERS.

9:00 PM [doveseyes] blue...I always love the part when the prodigal h who is restored talks about how miserable he was...my h doesn't seem miserable...told kids he is so happy..happiest he has been in a long time

9:01 PM [dogwood] lisak-- while my H is planning to move out, and sorting our financial assets and doing income taxes, he is running away everyday during the evenings I would come home. In a few cases that we run into each other, he does not talk to me and he does not want me to greet him either. Should I follow his wishes? or should I still greet him with a smile?

9:01 PM [lisak] dogwood - it never hurts to smile. And it's not you that bothers him, it's his own guilt!

9:01 PM [digforhelp] lisak - thank-you. I will take your advice to heart and put it into practice. even though it may be difficult at first.

9:01 PM [Bluesky] doveseyes I agree that is good to listen too. I too wonder the same.

9:01 PM [digforhelp] this is really some good stuff. I am feeling a little hopeful. :)

9:02 PM [lisak] digforhelp - get up every day and go for it. Idle time belongs to Satan - don't allow Satan to mess with your mind.

9:02 PM [doveseyes] wiffe...I hear you. I have often thought...I should let him take the kids...and let me have a mlc...ha ha...but lisa is right...your kids know who they can depend on...and it isn't your h...it’s you...

9:02 PM [doveseyes] blue...what part hit you

9:03 PM [wiffe] doveseyes it is so hard. they need and want him here. Like D7 just clings to his leg (in a play fashion) but doesn't seem to know when to stop and he wants to leave. Just kills me.

9:03 PM [Bluesky] wiffe yes, I agree, you need to be the stable one.

9:03 PM [wiffe] lisak I'm doing ok. Like the day I wanted my nails done I took them to my brothers. Now one night I had a friend watch them and he got mad in a sense. But what was I to do.

9:03 PM [lisak] Wiffe - he has no right to get mad - you're allowed to have a life. He just doesn't like that. Often they think they are "punishing us" by leaving us with the kids while they "party" - but it's not a punishment, it's a blessing that will be rewarded in Heaven.

9:03 PM [wiffe] all I get to see them grow fully. He can claim to watch them grow but he has no clue. Just kills me. He acts like his Bio-dad

9:04 PM [hepsy] all - time for me to go. take care and hang in there!

9:04 PM [Bluesky] doveseyes I think it was Sondra saying she took her h for granted. I never felt that way, but the way she described was helpful. I was listening to that part just as I walked past a moving truck that said Exodus on it.

9:04 PM [doveseyes] lisa...that’s a good point about idle time...I have so pulled back from everything since this started with my h over 1 year ago...

9:04 PM [lisak] ALL - No idle time allowed for any of you this week. Get out there, have fun, take walks, volunteer at your church, and most important, get into a small group Bible study - you all will need that support going forward.

9:05 PM [doveseyes] wiffe...I know...it kills me to watch their pain. But, I am believing that someday this will all make sense...how god will use this for their good.

9:05 PM [dogwood] lisak-- when he initiates talk with me, he often brings up the fact that I can still smile or live my life normal, but he can't stay in the house anymore with me. I don't know the rationale he probably thinks I don't take it as serious as he does regarding our "failing marriage" or the incident of his "affairs". so, he blames on my light-hearted attitude?

9:05 PM [lisak] dogwood - it's all about his guilt - just keep loving God and smile whenever you want to.

9:05 PM [lisak] All - it's time to close up for the night. I've got to head off.....

9:06 PM [doveseyes] good night all

9:06 PM [Bluesky] goodnight and thank you all. Doveseyes best of luck and prayers for you.

9:06 PM [dogwood] All-- good night

9:07 PM [doveseyes] blue...same to you...

9:07 PM [digforhelp] all - good night

9:07 PM [wiffe] night

9:07 PM [lisak] Heavenly Father, please get everyone that was here tonight to be motivated to love You and serve You in all they do. Let Your light shine so brightly thru their lives, that the people around have to wear shades! :o) Please light a fire under them to volunteer and to take care of themselves the way You would want them to. Thank You Lord for the chat room and continue to bring everyone back here to learn to love You more and glorify Your Son in their lives and marriages. In Jesus' Name. Amen.

9:07 PM [dogwood] lisak-- so, it is okay to be pleasant in front of him and not joining his depression

9:08 PM [lisak] dogwood - yes of course. do not ride his rollercoaster for anger and depression. That's what he wants to see you do. But love the Lord your God every minute and smile for HIM.

9:08 PM [lisak] Good night Dogwood.

8:07 PM [doveseyes] bill...I am doing horrible. Just found out a potential health problem that could be bad. I informed my h who said well, I care about you as the mother of my kids by I don’t love you and I want a divorce. then he spent times with each of our kids and bashed me. told them all the reasons he left and pursued tons of women. what say you?

8:07 PM [Bill] Doveseyes: First of all, I am so sorry. In a perfect world, things like this would never happen and I know it breaks your heart to hear such things. Give yourself permission to grieve because these things overwhelm the heart and build up intense emotions which need to be relieved somehow. Then pray like crazy for wisdom to know how to respond. Defending yourself to your kids or retaliating won't do you any good. I think we can all agree to pray for you and ask God to do a physical healing and a healing of the heart.

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Chat Room Acronyms

Guests often use acronyms to speed up their conversations. Here are a few examples for you:

I have been S from my H for 2 years. We have 3 children, S8, S13, and D16.
I have been Separated from my Husband for 2 years. We have 3 children, Son age 8, Son age 13, Daughter age 16.
  OW = Other Woman   AW  = Adulteress Woman   W  = Wife   OP = other person
  OM  = Other Man   AM  = Adulteress Man   H  = Husband   LBS = Left behind spouse
  D = divorce or daughter   S = son or sister or separated   XW  = ex-wife   GF = Girl Friend
  DIL = daughter-in-law   SIL = Sister-in-law or Son-in-law   XH  = ex-husband   BF = Boy Friend
  MIL = mother-in-law   MLC = Midlife Crisis   PG = Praise God   CS = Child Support
  FIL = father-in-law   MLD = Midlife Dimensions Ministry   PTL = Praise the Lord   ED = Erectile Dysfunction
  w/ = with   w/e = weekend   b/c = because   
  w/o = without   BRB / be right back   LOL / laughing out loud